Sandra Hanschitz

I originally come from contemporary dance. I studied it and spent a lot of time with dance and a specific method — Axis Syllabus. On the one hand I felt like I had found my home in dance, and on the other hand I somehow wanted something new. Then I was in Helsinki at a street theatre festival and there was a performance by Sisus Circus where someone did Cyr wheel — I thought: Oh, I want to try that too! I wanted a new physical challenge, but first I had to find out what the thing was even called and what it actually is. After doing a workshop in Barcelona I bought a Cyr wheel. I spent a lot of time in Barcelona, trained, took private lessons. Because I trained at La Central del Cirque in Barcelona and met people there, I slowly slid into the circus scene.

Then I made a first small solo. The second solo/duo was already with Joël — “IIIII. about the art of letting go”. And then we got funding for research for dance and circus. At that time I still lived in Germany. Joël and I were flatmates in the same shared apartment for six years, that's how we met. He had already made music for a small piece — a dance piece — before. And I really appreciate his music. So I asked him again whether he wanted to make music for “IIIII”. From that collaboration the further collaboration for “still dependent” basically emerged.

Sandra Hanschitz

The reason it got bigger is that I wanted to explore the Cyr wheel in a trio. It's actually a solo discipline, but I wanted to see what was possible with two other people. In that case we chose a Cyr-wheel artist who also has a dance background, Lorena Madurga Jiménez from Barcelona, and a dancer from Freiburg, Linda Pilar Brodhag, who had never touched a Cyr wheel before. It was important to me to also look at the object with a dance eye and not necessarily stick to the circus discipline. That's how we came to ask Heidi, and of course there were more people involved.

Joël Beierer

The whole thing grew a bit because the production itself became bigger, since we decided to make a trio piece.

Heidrun Neumayer

Yes, the common point between Sandra and me is, for example, that we have a very similar background. We've known each other for quite a long time and have worked together in other formats again and again. We met through this movement method Axis Syllabus. And we also have a similar movement language. About ten years ago I too came into contemporary circus; in my work I also have a strong interest in repurposing things. So using circus apparatuses not necessarily for what they are intended, but taking them and seeing, okay, what else is possible with them — that's a shared denominator with Sandra.

Joël Beierer

I believe it really started from an initial interest. Then Sandra and I tried, as the core, to assemble the team around us. We realized we needed support in choreography when Sandra is on stage, because I am not a choreographer, but hold the dramaturgical threads and rather keep the big picture in view. Heidi was able to support us very well with her expertise in partner acrobatics elements, helping us sharpen the movement interest we formulated in the concept and then implement it concretely in rehearsal. The artistic side lay with Sandra and me; Heidi supported us on site. Sandra is also on stage and thus has this double role: in and out, which she doesn't particularly like. That's why I discussed a lot with Heidi: Okay, what's the goal, where do we want to go, how do we implement that — and then there are physical rehearsal blocks, usually one to two weeks, where everyone comes together. It was a very long process with the piece, overall over two years with preliminary rehearsals and research and so on.

Sandra Hanschitz

For me there was a really physical interest in the object — and on the other hand an interest in defamiliarizing the object, turning it into a spiral, suspending it. Because the Cyr wheel is actually a floor discipline. There was an interest in taking the object apart and working it over in the trio. That was definitely a starting point: first try out a lot. What is possible at all as a circle, as three, as a spiral. We also built other shapes and thus explored different — we called them “states” — physically. Always with an eye to reading content into it or seeing whether what wants to be expressed, what the piece basically wants to communicate, can be found in what we are trying out.

Joël Beierer

Yes, that was the origin idea of the concept. When we first sat together, Sandra had the idea of the trio, and the subject-object theme was important to me. I had recently been reading a lot in sociology about Bruno Latour and his actor-network theory, which looks at the complex web of human and non-human actors that relate to each other. In short: Do we change things or do they change us? That was my theoretical starting point. At the same time I was on tour with Sandra, making music, always sitting at the edge of the stage and watching Sandra as she danced, fought and worked with that ring. For me the two worlds simply came together there — the potential of this confrontation between subject and object was already obvious to me.

This circle, the Cyr wheel, has always had a strong shape and such a dynamic presence for me; therefore it was the perfect object to question the subject-object relationship. The dramaturgically interesting question for me was: If it's about subject-object relations: How can you play with the wheel, lift it, push it around, etc. Who has power right now, who doesn't? Then the thing needs to get life. How does the thing get life? Not if it's pushed back and forth all the time — but the impression must somehow arise that it does something by itself. That's why I also wanted it to appear first. So it has a chance to be alive. Because if the people come first, then the human comes in and the object just lies there and is moved. That was incredibly important to me. And that's why we did all sorts of things — so the thing becomes a subject.

Joël Beierer

This time the approach was really very process-oriented and I tried to always integrate the music. I tried to create moods. For me music takes on a soundtrack level. I knew I was actually writing film music here in this case. And you usually don't develop film music together with the film, but it usually comes on at the end. And it was the same here. Because I am in the artistic direction and was lucky to help shape the piece, I roughly knew where I might want which atmosphere. Then I make notes, write for example: this is threatening. Then the question is, do I want to counteract it or support it — a dramaturgical question. I wrote the music relatively late in the process. I like working with constraints — in the end about 70 percent of the sounds are only from the Cyr wheel. That creates a nice coherence, which I like.

And at the end of the process everything comes together. The opening scene, for example, the staccato-like, rhythmic, musical-with-light-support function: the eye will always find patterns. Your eye will find patterns because it wants patterns. That's how it works. And of course, when the music was set, we worked on sharpening movements to it and picked certain highlights.

Heidrun Neumayer

I found that particularly interesting in the process, which is also somehow logical: what the artist wants to express and their specific idea is not always exactly what people in the audience then see or perceive. And I think the three of us basically had the same understanding of what it's supposed to be about and what the direction is, but still each of us brought their own pinch of perspective. That can be interesting in the working context because you sometimes feel like you understand different things. But in the end I think that brings a certain color with it. For me liveliness has a lot to do with sensing and being in the moment.

Sandra Hanschitz

Quickly on the threat aspect: I actually do find that the thing can be threatening. Of course I give an impulse — but when the Cyr wheel wobbles dynamically around the space, it's simply a piece of steel that has real force if it hits a person.

Sandra Hanschitz

The ring weighs about 14 kilos. Each of us on stage has an idea of what it feels like if you weren't fully attentive and couldn't get out of the way in time. It's really a process to understand it, to let yourself engage with it, to learn to read it. What actually happens to my impulse that I put in, how does it manifest through the object? What comes out of it? From my experience, in most cases what I put in comes back. If I give a strong impulse, I get a strong response. And if the impulse is softer, rounder, gentler, then it will take the movement. And yes, that's how liveliness arises for me in the dialogue and in the action. Really this sensitive sensing, reading, being present. A reciprocal action arises: I put something in and get an answer. I then reply to that. That's how the dance with the object comes about.

Joël Beierer

Picking up on the question of what liveliness even is and what the interest in it is: For me that's an open question. We have categories for it: heartbeat and nervous system are things we try to link with it in biology. But what is interesting in a performance context is: How does liveliness show itself, how does it feel? How can you make something that you know is not alive per se become alive?

Joël Beierer

It only becomes interesting for me if it also has something transcendent that leads out of the space. So it can be beautiful like that, but my wish is that it gets another level. And the Cyr wheel simply stands for the material world to which we do not ascribe agency, which we say: we use it as tools or it's just scenery. It equally stands for the environment that the climate crisis increasingly makes clear to us, how dependent we are. Actually it's about pointing out dependencies: look, we are dependent and the message is: that's not terrible at all. Let's just look at it. It's even beautiful, there's an incredible potential for encounter, for real experience in it. What Sandra described on the physical level, what the dancers feel: being in dialogue, that this beauty and this power that is in it is emphasized. To say: look, that's not only in there when they dance with the Cyr wheel, but that's actually our relationship to the world. That's reality.

Sandra Hanschitz

I don't think about it very theoretically. Because I deal a lot with the body, for me it's something that has to do with a very personal perceptual process. It's really an inquiry, for example: What can I actually feel? In our case we worked with the Cyr wheel, but the same question arises when I touch a computer, sit on a chair or whatever. How much can I connect or resist something, when does something become uncomfortable, when does conflict arise and where does connection arise, where does synergy arise. For me it's a practice of perception, of presence, of feeling. That's what interests me about objects. And of course it's something that takes time to train. Perception always becomes finer and I find that super interesting.

Heidrun Neumayer

I don't perform on stage, but I do have a movement background and so it's always interesting for me to be outside and observe how differently it feels internally and how it looks externally. Those often go in completely different directions. I remember Joël and I often agreed, "ah yes, that's the direction it should go." And internally it was like, "Yes, but it feels somehow strange." And building that bridge is often the challenge. I think for me it was sometimes an interaction of: there's a head idea of what direction it should go, you work from the movement material consciously in that direction. And then there's the opposite direction, where sensing is in the foreground or where you look internally: what is the intention. With that intention you go into the movement and see if it can be reflected externally.

Joël Beierer

I think that's also the strength of our collaboration: it again points to this process question, this play of bringing the outside into the inside. This play of outside into inside was sometimes a challenge. Of course it also means friction, because you repeatedly encounter communicative friction moments where perceptions differ. But I think that's exactly the strength of our work. The concept would be empty if Sandra or the dancers didn't have this inner experience and we didn't try to bring that back out.

Heidrun Neumayer

Honestly, I'd have found a 1-to-1 situation harder, meaning one Cyr wheel, one person. In my own work I always work a lot with groups, with several people. Here you see three women and a Cyr wheel — but actually it's a quartet. In this context one doesn't work without the other. The Cyr wheel alone doesn't work. I have to give some impulse for anything to happen with it. In the human body it's basically the same. One is in a way lifeless as a cell body. But everything that moves needs an impulse. I found this trio story very interesting in terms of transporting the people. This giving and taking of weight always stands for me for self-responsibility and responsibility for others. And the question: how much of each?

Sandra Hanschitz

The plan is to tour the piece, to perform it.

Joël Beierer

It was our plan, from the collaboration of Sandra and me, already in the previous piece (“IIIII”) to produce something that is also sustainable, something that can be performed again. We want to tour with it, we want to reach people. You also get funding and so on, and I see myself as an artist also responsible for producing something that reaches people. Practical aspects have always played a role: how do you create something that is tourable? I'm currently in the booking season for 2026. We also made an outdoor piece from “still dependent”, “still interwoven”. There the focus shifts a bit. We have three dancers on stage, we no longer have a hanging object, we like to play 360 degrees and want to reach outdoor festivals and street performances with it. A short version for outdoors also relies on audience interaction.

Heidrun Neumayer

One thing important to me, because we want to work sustainably: we were really lucky with the support we received from funders and from various festivals and so on. I know that's not a given. And yes of course we worked well — but that good working was precisely made possible by that support.